@ jdmorris,

Welcome To the Forum.

Suggest trying DVDSanta (http://www.dvdsanta.com) at to cover Pal to NTSC.

Best Regards,
bjkg

Thanks for answering. If they didn't lock you up for ordering R2 then I guess I can order legally. Amazon only for me, though. Too many scandals in the news about ebay and I don't want to bid, just order.

I'm experieced in backing up but never attempted other region backups. But I thought I would'nt need a PAL DVD player or need to convert NTSC to PAL because I'll do an AnyDVD backup which will render the copy region free for playing on my home entertainment equiptment. Right? or Wrong?

If I'm wrong, it must be because region coding and NTSC vs PAL are two differnt things. DVD Santa would force me force me down the compression path which I simply won't do. I split my backups to get full, original quality.

Thanks again,
Whisperer

You can.

Wrong. PAL and NTSC are different TV Standards. PAL has a vertical resolution of 576, NTSC of 480 pixels, so PAL DVDs have a higher resolution.
NTSC has almost 30 fps, PAL only 25 fps. This makes conversions from/to NTSC difficult, as the different frame rate will cause "shutter".
Not only must your DVD Player be capable of playing PAL DVDs. Your TV Set must be capable of displaying PAL as well. There are DVD players which are able to "convert" PAL to NTSC - they output a NTSC signal when playing PAL DVDs. But this sucks big time, trust me.
Each format has its own problems (NTSC = Never The Same Colour), most notebly when playing movies. Movies are played with 24 fps in theatres. This does not really work well when converted to 30 fps (NTSC) or 25 fps (PAL).
In case of PAL, movies will simply be played with 25 fps instead of 24. I hate this, because in PAL countries movies are not only 4% shorter (5 Minutes for a 2 hour movie), but the sound is 4% higher in pitch as well. Most people don't notice. I do.
NTSC DVDs have a different problem (apart from lacking resolution): 24 fps -> 30 fps will cause "micro shutter", because one picture is showed 2 times, the next 3 times to match the average framerate of 30. Again, most people don't notice. Again, I do.
The easiest way to find: Order a cheap DVD at amazon.co.uk, amazon.fr or amazon.de and try it out.
Your PC will play PAL DVDs, of course. But this is probably not what you want - watching DVDs on your PC. But this is exactly what I did to solve all NTSC / PAL problems: I have a dedicated PC to watch DVDs. With the correct software the PC can even compensate the 4% "PAL-Speedup" http://www.michaeldvd.com.au/Article...PALSpeedUp.asp
and if you set the refresh rate of your monitor to 48 or 72 Hz (2x24/3x24) you can even eliminate NTSC's "Micro Shutter" problems.

Tru,
You never cease to amaze me with your infinite wisdom.

Hello Folks,

Sometime ago I purchased a PAL Commercial DVD Tile (the Bogart classic African Queen) from eBay and using AnyDVD- DVDSanta made a region free NTSC backup copy. This converted region free NTSC backup copy plays correctly in my USA desktop stand-alone DVD player and USA television.

I did not encounter any of the problems as described by Forum Member Tru in his #28 posting in this thread. Perhaps my vision and hearing is not as acute as Forum Member Tru but my family, friends, and I did not notice anything peculiar with my region free NTSC conversion backup copy.

I paid for this eBay purchase using the famous PayPal payment option to alleviate any scam concerns.

Best Regards,
bjkg

This "wisdom" is nothing more than what is written on various webpages. Apart from having some experience with NTSC and PAL DVDs, I simply use Google from time to time...
If you want a more accurate description how the movie to NTSC Video conversion works, you might find these articles useful:
http://www.dvdfile.com/news/special_...2_pulldown.htm
http://www.projectorpeople.com/tutorials/pulldown.asp
although the above links do not describe the "micro stutter" problem I mentioned (I said "micro shutter", this was a typo), especially when you have a progressive scan DVD player.

This site explains the 2:2 pulldown for PAL DVDs as well:
http://nickyguides.digital-digest.com/interlace.htm

If you are looking for software which eliminates the 4% PAL Speedup as described here http://www.michaeldvd.com.au/Article...PALSpeedUp.asp, you can find it here: http://reclock.free.fr/

If you want to experience the "PAL Speedup" yourself, without the need to order a Region 2/4 DVD, visit this page:
http://www.mastersofcinema.org/bress...ALspeedup.html

It has sample MP3 files for direct comparison.

Gentlemen (and Tru ),
Since one cannot just walk into a consumer electronics store and buy PAL equiptment in the USA, I'm going to suggest a good purchase source for solving the problem of playing other region PAL ordered movies on an NTSC (USA) home entertainment system (ie the TV can be NTSC too). Maybe I am naive and you guys already know where to buy this stuff(?)

By way of of a background story, just one day before the Digital Millenium Copyright Act took effect in the USA sometime around October 2000,
http://www.gseis.ucla.edu/iclp/dmca1.htm
I purchased a "hardware-altered" Sampo DVD player. This "grandfathered me in", so to speak, to legally possess such a device before the law took effect. The Sampo allowed me to override copy protected player output and backup my DVD movies to my JVC S-VHS VCR on SuperVHS tape. This was before DVD to DVD backup software was available and I thought backing up a DVD (480 lpi) to SuperVHS tape (400 lpi) was a serious technological marvel!

Anyway, I found this company, "MindLogic", to be a reputable orgainization because they delivered what they promised in both customer quality care and technology.
Funny thing ... I was so afraid to leave a paper trail that I drove 450 miles north from L.A. to Concord California (red Corvette, Coast Highway, pretty girl with me, nice trip ) to purchase the Sampo (with cash) at the non-retail type business/shipping site of Mindlogic and even gave a false name for the warranty info. It was just an old warehouse building with a bunch of scruffy, engineering and tech types who had a great idea to provide what a large segment of the public wanted to buy! Glad I bought that last day because, indeed, the very next day, such devices disappeared from their website and could no longer be purchased.

Anyway, this same motley crew now hardware-alter regular DVD player circuitry to make them region free PAL to NTSC converter players. Main web page:
http://www.mindlogic.com/index.shtml

This is the web page of their whole line of such players:
http://www.mindlogic.com/Prod_MSDVD.shtml
Be sure you select a model that states it has a "Built-In Video Converter".

And since my whole home entertainment system is exclusively JVC this is the player that I will order:
http://www.mindlogic.com/MSDVD_JVC_xv-n312s_DTL.shtml

Tru,
You were such a wealth of information in your above posting. Thank you. Before I order, what do you think of the JVC in the next above link. Should I be able to, with that player, now be able to add to my collection by ordering old Brittish movies available only in R2 PAL DVD format standard and have them play on my US home entertainment system? Your opinion, even with disclaimers included , means a great deal to me

Best regards, and thank you very much,
Whisperer

As I said, I usually don't use stand alone devices and I don't know much about them. My experience in the past was - the cheaper the player (from China or Taiwan), the better it performed in switching PAL/NTSC configurations. Maybe because the "cheap" manufacturers only build one type hardware and flood the whole world with it.
My 15 years old Sony TV has no problem with NTSC/PAL input.
But before you buy anything: Order the cheapest PAL DVD from Amazon. They have some cool movies for less than 5 pounds (about 10$?). Try it in your player. Read the manual of your TV and player if it doesn't work. I believe a lot of devices can do "both" standatds, even if it is not mentioned in the manual. Try it on your PC.

Tru,
I have engineering friends from India who came to America via the UK and the PAL disks they brought with them don't play on my rig. Too modern a set up, with all the region "safeguards" built in, I guess. So I think'd I've got to buy something like the above Mindlogic altered player rig. And "cheap" manufacturer's players often don't have the progressive scan feature or 6.1 or 7.1 DTS or Dobly with THX capabilities I want. And, in the end, I'm still stuck with a $3000 NTSC widescreen TV which may not respond to the PAL output of such cheap players ... right?

All good suggestions above, thank you, though obtaining and experimenting with cheap players seems more trouble than just spending the money on Mindlogic's solution. ... if that be a viable solution(?) Should be from what I read.

Whisperer

And my PC is not rigged for home entertainment output like your's must be. It just plays on a little 21" "square" monitor, no progressive resolution, no surround, no nothin'. It's just a dedicated box for making backups of my collection as I add to it.

Need a solution that fits my real entertainment equiptment.

PC displays are always progessive.

Err... you did back them up first with AnyDVD & CloneDVD? And tried the backup? Because the original is region coded and will not play, of course.

Tru
Didn't know that, thanks.

I would prefer a DVD Changer anyway since, I split all my backups to retain original quality. But my present changer is, of course NTSC based. I just spoke to one of the techs and he said they can order me a JVC Changer/Player with ALL the features I want and hardware-convert it for only $100 more than the regular retail list price!

What the hell, it's only money, and I love movies!!!

Oh ... ya ... duh! OK ... OK, I'll borrow a PAL disk and try that.

I will, of course, destroy the backup after the experiment, since I didn't buy it myself... my friends have the Bollywood type movies, which are very respectable productions, but I don't know that I would want to get into ordering a collection of them.

is there a region hack for your DVD player to make it region free ?

Bjproc,
Intriguing question.

You mean a hardware hack? I'd be real worried about opening my player case-cover and trying that.

You mean a firmware hack? How does one "get" firmware into a player/changer device?

Post a link to such info or methods if you know of one please.

Can't post back for 1/2 an hour. Gotta do a chore.

Best regards,
Whisperer

no, all you do here (uk) on most is open the drawer and punch in some numbers.

go here http://www.videohelp.com/dvdhacks.php?select type in your make/model in the search bar and see if it comes up with anything to make it multiregion

you can upgrade your firmware on a dvd player if your player allows it, by burning to disc and placing it in your player, there are instructions on how to do this.

here you go:
http://germanangels.de/wbblite/porta...dc8d2edbb1896c

Thanks Bjproc and to vomitator for his added assist.

Even if I can get a Region Code hack to work on my player, that still leaves one with the problem of PAL to NTSC conversion, per my discourses above with Tru, does it not?

it does, i'll have to think better...!

But thanks anyway. Interesting thread, ya? Two pages of excellent information. Definitely a keeper!

Tru, whatever you do for a living, I hope they pay you enough!

do you think your player plays PAL disc's and it's just the region that stops them or do you think that it won't play them at all

I have a Zenith (LG) DVD player with upscale conversion that plays DVD's at 1080i.
The player is about 1 1 /2 years old and was one of the first with this upscale technology. I do have a hack that I found a link on a forum that will make it region free. I have the file on my computer but never installed it or intend to install it since I've never had the need to play region free disks.

Below are the instructions how how to install this particular hack, I would believe others are simialar. I would have never thought about the burning in iso mode.
I doubt that this hack would permit it to play PAL DVD's, however, both the DVD player and TV can be adjusted for different video modes.
Everything works fine, and if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

1) Unzip the folders and files to the hard drive in exactly the same order.
2) Burn the folder "RMT000" (including sub files and/or folders) to a blank CDR
3) Make sure you set; 'close' disc and session
4) Make sure you burn the disc in ISO mode (not joliet)

Insert the disc in the player and follow the screen instructions

Bjproc,
Doubt very much that my player plays PAL. But am going to do what Tru suggested to counter my wrongthink:
My R2 friends are all at work now. My day off. So, I'll test as time and friend's generousity & response permits.

Which is the point of what I am trying to do. But none the less the firmware update method is yet another good posting to this most excellent thread.

I have a feeling that in the end, I'll end up buying MindLogic's hardware-altered JVC Changer (see above post #32 & #38)