Readability problems - Club CDFreaks

dvdhoek · 02-12-2003

I own the BTC DRW1004IM for about a week now. I experienced that the disks do not play in certain DVD ROM players and stand-alone players. It does for example not play in my AOpen 12x DVD Rom. And some players (for example my Philips DVD 633) do play the disc, but not without problems, sometimes the movie freezes, skips to another part or totally stops playing after a while.
I compared the discs to copies made with a NEC 1100A. The NEC discs are readable in all players without any problem. I even did a 1:1 copy with Nero of a NEC burned disc, but again the copy was not readable in my dvdrom (used same media again).
The last media I tried are on the compatibility list (Arita 2,4 MID RICOHJPNR00).
I don't expect that this problem is specific for my recorder, since a couple of colleagues bought the same recorder and experience the same problem.
The firmware used is 043. I hope that a future firmware can solve the problems, since I otherwise rather would have bought me a NEC 1300 burner.
I asked for support by sending a message to cdrw@btc.com.tw, but only got standardized reply messages, with one of them pointing to a missing attachment that I have to fill in

What should I do? Take the risk to upgrade to 045? Wait for a newer firmware? Try to switch the drive for a NEC? Or only play the movies in the burner itself (which always works until now)?

*pdu* · 02-12-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by dvdhoek
What should I do? Take the risk to upgrade to 045? Wait for a newer firmware? Try to switch the drive for a NEC? Or only play the movies in the burner itself (which always works until now)?

Hi,
If possible wait for firmware 0047. I would not recommend 0045. If you want a drive that works "out of the box" you should probably go for a NEC 1300 or Pioneer 106. However the BTC drive has superior specs compared to these drives and dont forget the great amount of work Marco of BTC has put in getting this forum up and running. You wont find this with NEC or Pioneer. My deepest thanks to Marco.

I think that the BTC drive will turn out to be a good drive eventually. But we might need a few firmware updates before this happens. For now (and this is just my opinion, others may disagree) media support is lacking, write strategies for many DVD-R need tuning and firmware 0045 introduced burning quality/readability problems - at least on some media. Besides I think Nero's write engine is very buggy at the moment, so it's hard to know who to blaim - BTC, Ahead or both?? Why the h... is everyone using Nero 6

Would be nice with some success stories from users of other mastering software.

Personally I will wait for firmware 0047 before swapping this drive for something else. However I have to say that if firmware 0047 doesn't show some improvement compared to 0045, I'll have to "let the BTC drive go.

Cheers,
Peter

dvdhoek · 02-12-2003

I do not use Nero 6, but 5.5, because it was delivered with the drive. I did not try DVD-R yet, only DVD+R. I wanted to use Pinnacle Instant copy, but that does not support the drive yet. Which program would you recommend then?

*pdu* · 02-12-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by dvdhoek
I do not use Nero 6, but 5.5, because it was delivered with the drive. I did not try DVD-R yet, only DVD+R. I wanted to use Pinnacle Instant copy, but that does not support the drive yet. Which program would you recommend then?

Well, for the time being I have only used Nero 6.x and latest 5.5 version. However the latter did not work at all for me.

I would like to try NTI Cd-Maker or/and CeQuadrat(Adaptec) WinOnCD. I have used WinOnCD some years ago - before Nero was available - and at the time it was a fine piece of software. I have heard alot of nice things about NTI so maybe this could prove to be a solution as well.

Cheers,
Peter

buf · 03-12-2003

oh, the good old days...

unfortunately, i don't think WinOnCD is the same, anymore. Roxio bought it, so now it's called Easy CD Creator... the latest version I got is nothing compared to the first one I had (very good indeed).

I tried kmueller's combo (f/w 045 with nero 6.0.0.19) and you know what? it works!! at least for the time being...
i must apologize to Marco, cause i'm using a hacked firmware, but it was the only way to test the combo. as soon as 047 comes out, if it works, i'll switch, cause i don't really need the drive unlocked (i only read/write region 2 dvds).

tonight i'll write a few more dvds (AN31, essencially) and, if it works, I'll post.

BTW: i made a speed measurement test in nero, before writing, and it said it could only write at 2x because "source data is too slow" or something. I was burning from the HD. If i defrag, does it solve the problem?

doomking2002 · 03-12-2003

My problems are very similar. I have managed to upgrade my f/w from 038 (factory) to 043 (tdb) but after almost killing my dvdr (had to hot swap the power supply). So I am a little uneasy to flash again. DVD-R(W) play very strange in my Panasonic RV 62 (skip, freeze,crash completely).
That is why I am so anxious to get bitsetting in firmware (I have already posted on the subject), maybe the ability to set DVDs to DVD-Rom would settle my problems.

My machine:
Athlon 2100+, HD 80gb, Geforce 4, Sony CRX 220E1, BTC DWDR 1004i (f/w 043), WinXP Pro SP1, Nero 6.023 (Nero 6.019 was not any better maybe even worse), DVD-Decrypter, DVD-Shrink 3

I have tried AnyDVD-Clone DVD combo and I have tried 321 DVD X Copy Express. Same results.
I am a bit pissed of with this drive although I agree that Marco

BTC is really one of a kind, and that kind of support is hard if at all possible to find.
So like PDU says if next firmware doesn't fix things BTC goes.

buf · 03-12-2003

regarding readability problems...

some program, i can't remember which, told me that btc 1004 doesn't have/support burn proof. maybe that's the reason why some dvds give readability problems. if the HD is fragmented (even a little) in some point of the files you're burning, then data delivery speed from the HD reduces, and the burner doesn't wait for it, so maybe we get empty sectors (or something, i don't know!).

might it be the problem?
correct me

Centurio · 03-12-2003

BTC's BurnProof is called SuperLink.

Regards, Martin

buf · 03-12-2003

thanks for the correction, Centurio.
so that's not the problem...

ICDBEUTW · 03-12-2003

It is important to open the function of DMA(Direct Memory Area) where the DVD burner locates.

I used to burn DVD-R movies which have frozen or stop phenomenons in my home DVD player. I found that the main problems are owing to DMA closed or the driver about IDE(DMA) not installing correctly.

I reinstalled the right drivers for IDE(DMA) and all the strange things were gone.

By the way, the right and good blank DVD medias are still very important. (I use Ritek 4X DVD-R G04 "purple dye")

buf · 03-12-2003

ok, so i have to install the right drivers for IDE(DMA)...
where do i get those?
i just made my last test: after i defragged both c and d drives (hd), i tried to burn a dvd at 4x, but the speed test still said that "source data is too slow", so it only burns at 2x.
tonight i think i'll try to change the cable (see if it's that), and, if someone explains it to me, i'll install the ide drivers.

-------------EDIT--------------
i'll open a new thread for it. maybe there are people with the same problem...

dvdhoek · 03-12-2003

DMA is already enabled. Note that the problem is not that the disc is totally unreadable. In some players, it's playing fine, but in other players it isn't, while a disc recorded with the NEC 1100 A is readable in all players I tried.

ajz · 03-12-2003

Back in the beginning of the CDR era (just a few years ago), the problem related with certain burnt media being legible or not in some readers was usually laser-intensity and/or laser-alignment/calibration related, though the former was more usual.

When the intensity is somewhat weak, it makes it hard for some readers to distinguish the burnt from the unburnt, or simply the "ones" and the "zeroes", so they'll simply not recognize the disc, skip some portions, or hang, whereas other "more flexible" readers will have no problems at all.

Now when it comes to DVD recording, this issue becomes a lot more important, considering the increased data density of DVD vs. CDR.

dvdhoek · 03-12-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by ajz
Back in the beginning of the CDR era (just a few years ago), the problem related with certain burnt media being legible or not in some readers was usually laser-intensity and/or laser-alignment/calibration related, though the former was more usual.

When the intensity is somewhat weak, it makes it hard for some readers to distinguish the burnt from the unburnt, or simply the "ones" and the "zeroes", so they'll simply not recognize the disc, skip some portions, or hang, whereas other "more flexible" readers will have no problems at all.

Now when it comes to DVD recording, this issue becomes a lot more important, considering the increased data density of DVD vs. CDR.

Sounds like a plausible explanation for the problem I experience. Is this something that can probably be fixed by a firmware update or is this hardware related?

Ronald42 · 03-12-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by dvdhoek
Sounds like a plausible explanation for the problem I experience. Is this something that can probably be fixed by a firmware update or is this hardware related?

According to Marco in another topic this is regulated by the firmware let's hope V047 of the firmware will fix this and let's pray it will be availible soon.
Now we're here we know what and what not to do. What about a lot of poor people who bought the drive but have no Internet conection.

*pdu* · 03-12-2003

Quote:

Originally posted by buf
oh, the good old days...

unfortunately, i don't think WinOnCD is the same, anymore. Roxio bought it, so now it's called Easy CD Creator

Well almost true. Adaptec bought CeQuadrat some years ago and Roxio was founded. While Easy CD Creator is being sold in the US you can still get WinOnCD - at least in Germany. Just take a look at http://www.roxio.de/german/products/wocd6_pe/index.html

Dont know why Roxio chose this approach but...

Cheers,
Peter

buf · 03-12-2003

good news for me, then. i'm already feeling nostalgic.

guess i'll have to get it

dvdhoek · 13-12-2003

Firmware 0047 didn't seem to make a difference. The disc created by the BTC is still readable in less players than the one created by a NEC 1100 A. For example the disc is not readed by my AOPEN 1240 DVD ROM and Labway Xwave LB900 player, while NEC created discs are. I agree that these players are relatively old, but the bitsetting for both the NEC and the BTC disc is DVD +R.

02-12-2003	#1 (permalink)
dvdhoek New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 14	Readability problems <a href='http://adstats.cdfreaks.com/www/delivery/ck.php?n=a13febf7&cb=INSERT_RANDOM_NUMBER_HERE' target='_blank'><img src='http://adstats.cdfreaks.com/www/delivery/avw.php?zoneid=30&cb=INSERT_RANDOM_NUMBER_HERE&n=a13febf7' border='0' alt='' /></a> I own the BTC DRW1004IM for about a week now. I experienced that the disks do not play in certain DVD ROM players and stand-alone players. It does for example not play in my AOpen 12x DVD Rom. And some players (for example my Philips DVD 633) do play the disc, but not without problems, sometimes the movie freezes, skips to another part or totally stops playing after a while. I compared the discs to copies made with a NEC 1100A. The NEC discs are readable in all players without any problem. I even did a 1:1 copy with Nero of a NEC burned disc, but again the copy was not readable in my dvdrom (used same media again). The last media I tried are on the compatibility list (Arita 2,4 MID RICOHJPNR00). I don't expect that this problem is specific for my recorder, since a couple of colleagues bought the same recorder and experience the same problem. The firmware used is 043. I hope that a future firmware can solve the problems, since I otherwise rather would have bought me a NEC 1300 burner. I asked for support by sending a message to cdrw@btc.com.tw, but only got standardized reply messages, with one of them pointing to a missing attachment that I have to fill in What should I do? Take the risk to upgrade to 045? Wait for a newer firmware? Try to switch the drive for a NEC? Or only play the movies in the burner itself (which always works until now)?

03-12-2003	#8 (permalink)
Centurio CD Freaks Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: not in Texas Posts: 148	BTC's BurnProof is called SuperLink. Regards, Martin __________________ Entia non multiplicanda praeter necessitatem

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02-12-2003	#3 (permalink)
dvdhoek New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 14	I do not use Nero 6, but 5.5, because it was delivered with the drive. I did not try DVD-R yet, only DVD+R. I wanted to use Pinnacle Instant copy, but that does not support the drive yet. Which program would you recommend then?

03-12-2003	#5 (permalink)
buf New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 17	oh, the good old days... unfortunately, i don't think WinOnCD is the same, anymore. Roxio bought it, so now it's called Easy CD Creator... the latest version I got is nothing compared to the first one I had (very good indeed). I tried kmueller's combo (f/w 045 with nero 6.0.0.19) and you know what? it works!! at least for the time being... i must apologize to Marco, cause i'm using a hacked firmware, but it was the only way to test the combo. as soon as 047 comes out, if it works, i'll switch, cause i don't really need the drive unlocked (i only read/write region 2 dvds). tonight i'll write a few more dvds (AN31, essencially) and, if it works, I'll post. BTW: i made a speed measurement test in nero, before writing, and it said it could only write at 2x because "source data is too slow" or something. I was burning from the HD. If i defrag, does it solve the problem?

03-12-2003	#6 (permalink)
doomking2002 New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Paris Posts: 2	My problems are very similar. I have managed to upgrade my f/w from 038 (factory) to 043 (tdb) but after almost killing my dvdr (had to hot swap the power supply). So I am a little uneasy to flash again. DVD-R(W) play very strange in my Panasonic RV 62 (skip, freeze,crash completely). That is why I am so anxious to get bitsetting in firmware (I have already posted on the subject), maybe the ability to set DVDs to DVD-Rom would settle my problems. My machine: Athlon 2100+, HD 80gb, Geforce 4, Sony CRX 220E1, BTC DWDR 1004i (f/w 043), WinXP Pro SP1, Nero 6.023 (Nero 6.019 was not any better maybe even worse), DVD-Decrypter, DVD-Shrink 3 I have tried AnyDVD-Clone DVD combo and I have tried 321 DVD X Copy Express. Same results. I am a bit pissed of with this drive although I agree that Marco BTC is really one of a kind, and that kind of support is hard if at all possible to find. So like PDU says if next firmware doesn't fix things BTC goes.

03-12-2003	#7 (permalink)
buf New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 17	regarding readability problems... some program, i can't remember which, told me that btc 1004 doesn't have/support burn proof. maybe that's the reason why some dvds give readability problems. if the HD is fragmented (even a little) in some point of the files you're burning, then data delivery speed from the HD reduces, and the burner doesn't wait for it, so maybe we get empty sectors (or something, i don't know!). might it be the problem? correct me

03-12-2003	#9 (permalink)
buf New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 17	thanks for the correction, Centurio. so that's not the problem...

03-12-2003	#10 (permalink)
ICDBEUTW New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Posts: 22	It is important to open the function of DMA(Direct Memory Area) where the DVD burner locates. I used to burn DVD-R movies which have frozen or stop phenomenons in my home DVD player. I found that the main problems are owing to DMA closed or the driver about IDE(DMA) not installing correctly. I reinstalled the right drivers for IDE(DMA) and all the strange things were gone. By the way, the right and good blank DVD medias are still very important. (I use Ritek 4X DVD-R G04 "purple dye")

03-12-2003	#11 (permalink)
buf New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 17	ok, so i have to install the right drivers for IDE(DMA)... where do i get those? i just made my last test: after i defragged both c and d drives (hd), i tried to burn a dvd at 4x, but the speed test still said that "source data is too slow", so it only burns at 2x. tonight i think i'll try to change the cable (see if it's that), and, if someone explains it to me, i'll install the ide drivers. -------------EDIT-------------- i'll open a new thread for it. maybe there are people with the same problem...

03-12-2003	#12 (permalink)
dvdhoek New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 14	DMA is already enabled. Note that the problem is not that the disc is totally unreadable. In some players, it's playing fine, but in other players it isn't, while a disc recorded with the NEC 1100 A is readable in all players I tried.

03-12-2003	#13 (permalink)
ajz CD Freaks Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Madrid, SPAIN Posts: 135	Back in the beginning of the CDR era (just a few years ago), the problem related with certain burnt media being legible or not in some readers was usually laser-intensity and/or laser-alignment/calibration related, though the former was more usual. When the intensity is somewhat weak, it makes it hard for some readers to distinguish the burnt from the unburnt, or simply the "ones" and the "zeroes", so they'll simply not recognize the disc, skip some portions, or hang, whereas other "more flexible" readers will have no problems at all. Now when it comes to DVD recording, this issue becomes a lot more important, considering the increased data density of DVD vs. CDR.

03-12-2003	#17 (permalink)
buf New on Forum Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 17	good news for me, then. i'm already feeling nostalgic. guess i'll have to get it

13-12-2003	#18 (permalink)
dvdhoek New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 14	Firmware 0047 didn't seem to make a difference. The disc created by the BTC is still readable in less players than the one created by a NEC 1100 A. For example the disc is not readed by my AOPEN 1240 DVD ROM and Labway Xwave LB900 player, while NEC created discs are. I agree that these players are relatively old, but the bitsetting for both the NEC and the BTC disc is DVD +R.