Obviously, it seems that noone at cdfreaks is interested in the fact,
that StarForce is able to ruin your whole system - it's possible to get
access on administrator-level EVEN as unprivileged user! Unbelievable?
No - I tryed out an exploit I found; and DAMN it works!

check this link here:

http://www.freewebs.com/starforcemeat/

inside is a readme and a demo-exploit and sources.

Seems that StarForce don't care about their customers security!

I will take back all my StarForce games monday. Unbelievable, I send
this exploit to cdfreaks but it seems noone is interested? I also used
the news-form to submit the news, still nothing? Why is this news ignored
by editors?

What exactly did you expect cdfreaks to do about this?
They do not have any control over what Starforce do with their software.

Perhaps you should be directing this mindless rant towards Starforce support.

btw: that SF can ruin your system was discussed in some threads before... especially prob's with usb devices and other system devices....

We do not ignore your news, but we have to check if it works and if the claim made are valid. Therefore I have forwarded the email to someone with more knowledge on this matter, and it depends on when he has time. Thanks a lot for sending it to us, but we have to check, standard procedure!

Look, everyone hates Starforce and what it does to your system, but theres no way around it and we will just have to put up with what it does. Don't like it? Complain to Starforce, im sure they will...reassure you in that matter.

star-force's reply on this:
http://www.star-force.com/index.phtm...1&category=200

I dunno about you all, but my computer is set up with various user access's, and although i am the sole admin on this computer, there are 4 restricted accounts in operation, and i would assume that in many family settings, with kids, the childrens accounts are going to be restricted. So that comment about the users is not very true, particularily with windows XP.

AngryPets - did you soley join this board to proliferate this information?

This is 'OLD' news mate, like those emails you received 4 years ago, that suddenly pop up in your inbox, marked LOOK AT THIS....

I have Soldiers and ColinMcRae05 installed and neither have blue-screened me, or broken my PC in any way, shape or form... I have used the SFCLEAN function and the drivers go, but sometimes the devices are still listed, even if the underlying driver files are deleted - this is a little weird, but guessing more a M$ bug than SForce?

If you have 'personal' issues with StarForce - speak to them...?

And, moaning about 'Security Threats' - I am guessing you are using the most 'secure' version of windows are you? - well guess what - there isn't one! And as for those appalling claims that StarForce is spyware - have you ever watched the packets being sent back to M$ after performing a 'Search' on your HDD? Or what information they are collecting when you UPDATE to protect against known vulnerabilities...?

I guess not.

Sorry if it sounds harsh, just sick and tired of 'useless', 'mindless' propoganda being bandied around by people that know less than a '5yr old' on the subject :-(

It seems the internet is only good for 'disinformation' nowadays - bring back the good ole' days....

MuzChap

i personally dont have a problem with StarForce, we end up installing drivers, spyware and all kinds of things every day with programs, we rarely complain about that. i think that people are using the "StarForce wrecks your computer" as a way of venting there frustration on not being able to copy it.

i say less time whining about StarForces drivers, more time working out how to beat it

ben

I believe, nobody here has really any idea, what starforce drivers can let any virusmaker do. That's bad.

Btw, this vulnerability proofs, there is much more done, as starforce like it

I agree with Kosmonaut. Maybe a very little people here really knows what SF is doing, and what type of problems may have.
Cause its drivers have been out there for a few years, they have been improving its working a lot.
SF only crash ( if it happens) the whole ATAPI read and relationated windows kernell, but it is so rare. SF is a very good anti-cracking system and very stable on almost every os.

I think CDFreaks members should discuss how to trick SF at a physical level, and not what SF drivers does or doesn't, installs or doesn't install.

There is many unusefull little apps/.dll/registries installed when u install a game ( for example), but nobody says a bit about. Some of them can harm ur installing engine or even increase ur windows registry with stupid strings.

SF had some windows bugs, but they have been fixed yet, so this should be over.

SF is not perfect, but i haven't seen many people working on its physical copying. Many people thinks it is almost impossible and thats is. Well, if i can make a 66% working copy (burned) using Blackchecks tweaker, why others can't?( two of every three launchs, work). i'm not a coder, and thats why i haven't a specific tool (and also needs a lot of time for testing), just use what SF should check.

Morg (suggestions?)

Hi Morglum,

you're talking about Twinpeak0.2? Which program are you using for dumping the BWA (BB5.1, BB2002, Alcohol)? What is your twin sector step? Last but not least which settings are you using in CloneCD (cdreaks profiles, modified profile)?

I don't agree - it isn't just StarForce that has this 'hacker' vulnerability, it is pretty much every aspect of 'Windows' that is the problem - allowing such code to run!

I agree with everybody else, lets stop whinging on and find a way around this - but to continually complain, is wasting time and effort - these posts never help - that was the point, I was trying so 'delicately' to put across! ;-)

Have a good one...

MuzChap

Well, Kalas as u are the one u requested how to proceed, i will reply just for u.
I wrote some time ago, in this same related forum, how SF works, with exactly where SF checks and how SF autenthicates its disc, but seems no one got interested in such thing. Well, we have, in spanish, here an article i wrote with a specific SF game (Kreed german version), in which i explain what we did. There is a problem with this, and it is almos every starforced game needs a different way of proceeding. SF checks a disc depending on its key, so no standart way to proceed with normal software.
I must explain i use the tweaker mod made by spath for its tages tools, so no prob till there. We do not use any BWA as well, but i would like to add one here to show why an original disc is authenticated and why a copy doesn't, we use manual sector editing. First, we use especific and comercial program to obtain where SF checks. It can't be done from the original disc on IDE drives cause SF drivers, so we must use emulation to see where. As we found why original distinguish from copy, it is no longer needed a RAID drive with ATAPI support (here someone must appears (thks anyway!).

Once detected where SF checks, we use twincreator to insert twin sector in two of its four SF checks. SF makes four checks to a disc:
First spins down drive capabilities to detect reading speed. This is a huge first check. Thats simple a speed check and it is exactly the same to copies or originals. No twin are added here.
Second check correlationates drive speed to see if that CD is a mastered disc. An original disc will always have higher timing that copies, and in a very mathematical way ( first stabilized timing from first check x 2 = time second check must last (in .ms)EXACTLY) A standart copy will always report less .ms than original has.
Third check have nothing to do with previous ones, and just checks some timing.
Fouth and latest check makes another sector range check and compare with third one. If it result the same in .ms ( as a copy will report), SF will see its a copy ( SF is checking asymetry). To this point we have now clear why a Plextor premium copy doesn't work ( at least 100%). A plextor premium will always pass first check, but not this one. Cause CD asymetry, the second check looks for CD asymetry, and thats what a premium will not pass without extra help.

So twin sector are added in second and fourth check. We add as needed to last a few .ms to fool the SF guardian module. i will post a bwa later to show something.

CloneCD wil do the burning job.

i will continue later, must leave. c all!

wow! so you think you will be able to make tools for a working copy of starforce 3?

oh btw the http://www.freewebs.com/starforcemeat/ account has been frozen for some reason

ben

Thanks a lot for the info Morglum,

I translated your Spanish article using BabelFish as I know maybe three Spanish words. In combination with your post I understand the checks in the way you explained it. According to the end of the text you won't tell us how creating a backup of SF3 exactly works, but I hope you'll do it soon .
p.s. I'm really interrested in the BWA, so see you later.

Morglum007, german version doesn't have sf, it was russian version you have logs from. There is no programm, that can variate absolute density. If you try to burn it with PlexPremium+(BlindWrite even at this developement stadium), that is almost the same, as with any other burner, nothing get changed, you still need a portion of luck.
And about this tool, you can adjust it for just one specified game, one specified key and one specified medium. That is a fortune, we have CDRW's
What i want to say with, i don't see any future to create a working copy on this way, it is too unconventional, imho. Emulation has the future.
Anyway, i don't know, how much peoples work for starforce, but one thing i know for sure, there are much more peoples working against starforce. And last happened events show, starforce is no more invulnerable.

Thks for the quotes Kosmo.

Well, maybe for u it is an unconvencional way of proceeding (not generic or public). As for Tages Twin sector can be detected, for SF requires previous researching. I have some more ideas, and i will not leave this so easy. I have been trying to mod installation packs for years, and some ones took me about two years, till finally i got it. With SF and working this way i will succeed, soon or later, that does not mind me.
I have a lot of ideas with twin, and i think working SF backups ( non installable usefull) can be made. i will modify CD structure at the beginning or at the end, but i will make SF guard module to beat dust, and no matter one year or two will last, i will do it.

TIP: BWA is only for demonstrating second part of SF checks with assymetry. It does not work for any other purpose.
TIP2: Besides having another tool for cr***ng purposes, i want to try it at physical level. Consider it something personal. Anyway, it is a pleasure to work with u!
morg

As promised, Kalas, here u are ur required BWA and where SF checks, in a general way. I think u have read my whole article, so then, u will understand what is happening between a copy and original
PAXROMANA is in green (Original) and PaxromanaBWA is red (copy).
I think that visually shows the accurate of SF, and where it checks on any disc.

Thanks for the images Morglum really interresting!

Sorry, i was wrong, original is in red and backup in green. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Morg @ Cdsteam

What if you use CD-R's with black or silver dye ,this will maybe improve the accurate of the copy..

By now, burned CDs has this estructure due recorders writing strategy. At the end of the track, writing becomes lineal. Almost every recorder on this planet writes CDs at lineal speed at the end, so SF can distinguish this in its last check. Maybe some CDs could work...but ....which ones?

so, if i had a cd press would a starforce 3 copy be possible?

U have replied urself!