I am experiencing a really frustrating problem. I am using Nero (5.5.10.54 bundled) and a Phillips DVD+RW824 drive.

If I make an exact copy of an audio CD on any CD-R then it sounds more or less exactly the same as the original, which is great. However, if I extract the audio tracks to wave files and then burn an audio CD using the extracted wave files (because I want to make CD's with my favourite tracks) then the audio quality of the resulting CD is not great at all. The tracks play ok but the overall tonal quality is always poor. For example, the bass sounds would be dull or muted and the overall sound of the CD would be a lot poorer. I didn't measure this scientifically, you're just going to have to trust my hearing. The results are always the same no matter what brand of CD-R I use. Every time, an exact copy of the original CD is fine but extracting the waves and then burning them results in poor quality audio. This is driving me nuts.

Does anyone have any ideas as to why this might be happening? Is there some kind of overall mastering on the original CD that is being lost when the tracks are extracted into wave files? I really would like an answer to this. By the way, I use EAC to extract the audio tracks into waves files.

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

Rickard.

The music on a CD is the same as a WAV. It is PCM if I recall correctly. The difference between PCM and WAV is just the WAV header info. It's been a while but I think this is correct.

I can't see why there would be a difference in sound. Maybe a 'blind' test would be good here? ::grin::

Correct, plain PCM sound.
There is the intel and the motorola specific PCM/CDDA extraction method.

Have you tried ripping as a cue+wav in EAC and then burning back at 4x on some good quality media with EAC?. My best guess however is that you are playing on older equiptment that does not work well with CD-R, if the EAC read/burn doesnt work then try a few other players.

I think you're all missing the point here. Yes, I know from a "digital" perspective that the data should be the same. However, when I copy the full original CD using the same drive, the same software and the same type of CD-R and play them on the same equipment as the CD's that I make using extracted wave files, the copies of the originals are always superior. And we're not talking about tiny little differences that might be indistinguishable in a blind test, we're talking so obviously inferior that a deaf person could tell the difference. I know none of this makes any sense, which is why it is frustrating me so much.

Maybe Nero is simply using different methods to convert wave files into CD audio data than when it uses when it simply extracts an entire image of an original audio CD? Maybe the conversion from CD audio to wave and back to CD audio is introducing some form of quality loss and maybe it is only a Nero issue. I will try some other buring software and see what happens. Thanks for any suggestions so far.

Rickard.

What program are you using to rip the music from the CD's? I'm no expert but this can make all the difference in the world. If you don't like EAC you could try Audiograbber. I find it much easier to use.

I am aware that making even a "lossless" copy will make very slight degrigation, although I have never been able to hear it myself even on very high quality audio systems, but this is why I said it may well be the audio system you are using to play back your CD-R copies is not used to CD-Rs (and I have used a few older players that havnt played CD-R well at all).

The only other thing to consider is that it is a copy protected CD with some kind of copy-degrigation feature. Does this degrigation happen on all CDs or just this one? I would try a few and see.

rickardlucey: Rest assured, the sound in PCM-WAV and in CDDA are identical. Any difference you're hearing - between a CD made from another CD and one made from WAV's - is not due to the fact that you're burning from WAV's. There is definitely some other factor involved here.

What speed are you burning CD->CD at? What speed are you burning WAV->CD at?

There is no degredation. As for the copy protected cd's, calling these redbook cd's is often a stretch.

I think some of the problem maybe your ripping program. Per chance are you normalizing the wav's?


Either that or it's all placebo effect.

rickardlucey
You haven't responded as to whether the problem occurs with many other CDs nor whether you can rule out that this particular CD is copy protected.

Probably just embarassed.