How it works and why it can't be copied?

are you going to tell us then?

Different people have different ideas. Olli says he knows, but won't tell. Venom386 also, apparently, knows, since he made a working backup, he says.

tages is a real bitch. the way tages has been explained to me is that certain sectors read different values when read at different angles. this cannot be replicated using conventional media...methinks. i'm 99.999999% certain you cannot burn the right values to be read at the right angles for the few sectors taht are actualy protected. motoracer checks the values by reading the sectors at the wavelengths, and then compares them to something *duno what*. if you have the non-pressed, only 1 set of values, u get the demo.

I think you might be mixing Tages and Starforce.

The angle that the disc is pressed at shouldn't affect the data that is read each time... And if it did, the data should be bad sectors... and even if they were read in audio mode, there shouldn't be a 50/50 split, the sectors should be distirbuted along a gaussian curve. Starforce measures the angle the disc was pressed at, and if it is different from the angle that is indicated by the serial code you enter, it won't run.

"Olli says he knows, but won't tell."

By the way, why he wouldn't tell it if he knows?

If you look closely at a Tages protected disk(ie. MR3) in good light you will notice an area of the disk, about 3/4 inch wide and about 3 inches long, that appears to have been 'brushed' with a substance that has slightly changed the reflectivity of the surface for that area. All Tages disks have this. The game code can apparantly 'see' this area. I don't think a copy program will ever be able to mimic Tages, because the protection is looking for a physically altered disc. I have played around with a few chemical substances to try to alter my cd-r disc, but haven't had any luck yet. If anyone has an idea what substance can be applied to the cd-r to change the reflective qualities on an areas of the disk without destroying it , we may have a shot at creating a successful back-up.

Because he also thinks it can be copied (Venom386 made a backup copy of it).

If he said how it works, another company could make an upgrade to copy it before he could.

<Venom386 made a backup copy of it

i doubt that.

He said so himself, and he's not the type to lie about this sort of thing, but then again, that still doesn't mean it's true.

what i mean is that tages use a special media, as someone else mentioned. at the part that looks 'glossy', i've read it actually has more than one set of values stored inside a sector, and that the reading angle determines which value you get. this may be wrong, but if it's right, that would make a lot of sense as to why its a real bitch to copy

Not only tages has been copied, but starforce too.I have done a working backup of starforce ( codename outbreak) that works everywhere.It really tooks a lot of time for reading in my toshiba ( 1402 and about a half and an hour)but when playing & installing(i think here is where protection test for original first)it is like the original one.I have tested the game and had done it so the copy also works like original does(tested on a toshiba 1402, plextor 24x ( mine), lg 16x and a creative dvd so copy has it guarantee..xD.With Tages and my unit no luck.

Still testing...

Has anybody notices that nobody who ever claimed to have copied Tagès can spell it properly? *g* scnr

As far as I read, Tagès protected CDs might contain manipulated F3-frames with invalid sync header to confuse cd-roms and make them read different data if you read the same sector several times. Sounds logically, but difficult to implement (esp. to find efm-patterns that can be read even if shifted by some bits)

This can never be copied in raw-dao-96-mode. You would need a read- and write mode where software does everything: get non-efm-decoded data from the reader and send efm-encoded data to the writer

Morglum007,

outbreak has starforce in the russian version. all other ones i saw
have laserlock, wich is not considered a protection at all.

this is what i believe , too. thus you cannot copy it with a normal cd writer. no way.

Then if outbreak has laserloc........where is the ring on the reflective zone of the original? and where is the hidden read only folder called laserlock? The original i have tested doesn't have any of this and doesn't work like a normal laserlock game.it was very strange when reading with my plex 24x and took 1 hour and a half to be read with my toshiba dvd:Maybe the version distributed in Spain wheren't protected..i don't know but it hasn't laserlock and i can asure it( i have been seing this protection for years and this game isn't like civilization 3( spanish version) which have laserlock "new")

Hope anyone could repsond this...thanks.....

Good luck!

Our civ 3 has, just like almost every new game, sd 2. If think the last non-sd2-games I saw ware st armada and d2lod....

...a contentious opinion!

Morglum007

ok, no laserlock folder, no laserlock.
i guess it has no protection then.
as far as i know starforce needs a cdkey that has to be
activated over the net, and it clearly shows the starforce logo.

> As far as I read, Tagès protected CDs might contain manipulated
> F3-frames with invalid sync header to confuse cd-roms and make
> them read different data if you read the same sector several
> times. Sounds logically,

It might sound "logically" to you, but it is not realistic.

It might sound "logically" to you, but it is not realistic.

OK, it sounds really difficult to implement. As I said, it is only one theory.

If you have any other suggestion how these terrible sectors could be implemented: Tell us...

> OK, it sounds really difficult to implement. As I said, it is only one
> theory.

I didn't say it "sounds really difficult to implement", I said it's wrong.
Manipulating syncs will not cause different bytes to be read. Clear
enough ?

Then....ok let's assume codename spanish version (game in english) doesn't have laserlock ( because no laserlock folder is present)but it really took a lot to be read in my toshiba and no way to be read with any program in my plextor ( hanging up the system when trying to COPY it to my HD,for playing it works perfect!)Original is perfectly clear of scratches or any watermark or any other strange sign on the reflective zone so......what's happening?I'm quite experienced user with copyprotections and haven't seen this thing anytime before.....It was very strange when reading and when installing (400 mb if i well remember) it takes a lot!!!!!!!!!( about 15 minutes......)By now a lot of misterious things happened but there is a key that puts me in doubt....
When you start the game it doesn't connect to internet BUT IT SHOW FOR A WHILE..............."Connecting to ............. server".....then launch.And i do not remember what name it shows for the server but it shows one quite peculiar i do not remember now......in my modest oppinion......it sounds like starforce( as i have read)

Please correct me, suggestions accepted and sorry for my poor english( haven't get dinner yet)xDDDD

Good luck!

Just out of curiousity, what would it do?

If you 'force' FES in v4, when not required, then you will get phantom errors, this is my experience. When I turned FES off, there were no errors and reading was a breeze. Now you're gonna tell me that you had FES on "auto"...

I did not used c4 to copy it,just c3.3.41 if don't mistake.And i tried it with FES schitched on in "auto" mode and "off" too.My plex did not read the cd anyway and the toshiba took a lot.Original and my copy seem to be the same, it makes unreadable with plex and those cloneCD.Haven't tried with CD4.Sometimes my toshiba hangs up too and need to reboot the system.It's a very pretty protection.....the most strange i have found yet: if you try to copy it your pc can "explode"(xD) and if you try to read just then it's normal...

Thanks for replies...