The hide CD-R media function in clonecd tray is a cheating function.!!!
Just follow these steps, and you will see:
1. try to burn sd2 2.8 disc via clonecd latest version.
2. turn off "Hide CD-R Media" function of clonecd tray
3. Put this copy in to CD-ROM/DVD-ROM device, we are very sure cd-rom/dvd-rom device cannot get ATIP info, so Hide CD-R media is needed in this case.
4. We all know clonecd cannot backup SD 2.8 games, so this copy should not work.
5. Don't get this disc out, just try to turn on "hide cd-r media" function of clonecd tray. and try to play the game again.

Ouch, you see, it works.!!! What hell is this, I need to turn on "hide cd-r meida" function for cd-rom/dvd-rom devices????
This function is a cheating function, it lets you think every copy is 1:1 copy, in fact, it is not.

You can try war craft III too, make a wrong copy with SAO at first, and try to turn "hide cd-r media" on again, you will see it will also work.

What a joke it is? Olli has given up on 1:1 copys a long time ago, since he made the "hide cd-r media" function.
The "hide cd-r media" function not only hides the atip code, but also emulates some protections. It is not good, because you are tricked into thinking you have a 1:1 copy when in fact you don't, most of the time you just got in the ###### trick made by clonecd guys.

I guess as far as 1:1 copys go CloneCD is falling down.

The "Ignore media type" function in alcohol 120% actualy does pure hide ATIP code function. and always has

From how it looks, you are burning your image with Hide CDR Media enabled??????

burning an image with hide cdr media enabled actually shouldnt work - as you cant very well burn when the burner isnt allowed to recognize blanks.

no offense, ph0enix, but your post doesnt make very much sense. you seem a little excited. calm down, and type slower.

hide cdr media arrived at the same time that safedisc 2.4 and securom new did.

Sorry Ckin but Phoenix is trying only to say us that the "Hide CD-R media" option of CloneCD tray isn't only an ATIP hidder but it also emulates bad sectors (for Safedisc) and Subchannels (for Securom).

what a load of crap!

I had you pegged as a better person than this. I'll respond when I've worked my way thru the post.

I just test some discs, I total agree what Ph0enix said.

I have liteon 48125s, and I only install CloneCD on this computer. As you know, I cannot make a copy from SD2 2.8x discs via CloneCD(4.1.0.1), I tested NFS HP2 and sims. This copy cannot work on my Pioneer DVD-116 DVD-ROM drive, but very interesting, after I turn on the Hide CD-R Media function for my DVD-ROM, it works now. :-) The same viewpoint, why I need Hide CD-R Media function for my DVD-ROM??

And I also test this issue with my Diablo II (sorry I don't have WarCraftIII), yes, it cannot be executed with SAO copied disc, and again, If I turn on hide cd-r media function, it works for me on DVD-ROM.

I think they really did some cheating trick over there.

And, guys, as I know, pure "Hide CD-R media" is no harm to recognize blank disc. Read ATIP command it not the only command can get ATIP and other infomation from empty discs. For empty discs, you still can use ohter functions to get ATIP and other information form empty discs. It is very to find this command in MMC3/SFF8090i specs.

I totaly agree this : The "hide cd-r media" function not only hides the atip code, but also emulates some protections.

PS. Sorry, I am from taiwan, forgive my poor english.

@Fr4nz are you associated with Alcohol in any way? I can see that you are a devotee of this program. The CDFreaks management can change your member title to suit your association.

@Ph0enix - the "Alcoholic" handle is not intended as a slur in any way and Developers/Testers etc are most welcome to participate in the CDFreaks Alcohol Forum - thanks

@maltworm - hello Martin, it's probably you

Hi FutureProof, Just pass by here. And saw you are talking about me. :-)
I guess he would be one of our beta testers.
I know this long time a ago, my colleague DragonX found this, and we posted this in the beta tester forum of Alcohol long time ago.

Sorry mate but i read with my toshiba xm-6702B and write with the lite-on 40125S for safedisc 2 then just pop it back in to the toshiba for playing no hide cdr function you see i live in the usa function is disabled.

If I remember correctly 'Hide CDR Media' does:
1. ATIP
2. PMA
3. Prevents Subchannel reading

Number 3. should allow imperfect SecuROM copies to work???

Cheers

I just tested three SD2.8 copies i made with CloneCD 4.0.0.1. They all work from my DVD without CloneCD's Hide CDR media.
And they work from my burner when Alcohol's Atip Hide is on.

So even if CloneCD's Hide CDR media "helps" to playback imperfect copies, it still burns fine 1:1 copies (for me).
At least Version 4.0.0.1

Pretty much looks like pure slander to me...

I've never had to use the 'hide CDR media' function to play any CCD copy so far (I never play from my CD_RW).

Someone has had a little too much to drink.........

Ph0enix has raised some issues that have been dealt with previously. Olli has talked about 1:1 after he was publically attacked by another well known and until then highly regarded software author. He has also elaborated further through this forum which is why I have a link to a search on his nick in Down & Dirty. In summary, this is what Olli has said:

• The original SD2 weak sectors are replaced with new sectors, still weak, but writeable by the writer
• "Hide CD-R Media" does do more than just that, as Kitna has recalled
• Hide CD-R Media can't be left on when reading SecuROM *new* which Kitna has alluded to
• The last two CCD versions cannot backup SD2.8x, only 4016 & 4019 can, and the new beta I'm testing

The "Ignore media type" function in alcohol 120% must do something more than just hide the ATIP because the protections look for the PMA as well which is not a part of the ATIP. As it says "Ignore Media Type" and not "Pure Hide ATIP", it must do something more than just hide the ATIP

dont slate clone cd as you never know ?
ive always been a fan of it because for me it was really a breakthrough and the first as far as im concerned to successfully backup my software ( back in the days of a 4x speed mitsumi lol)
as is always the case a lot of peeps find problems due to their hardware and , what hardware you have really does depend on what you can do with clone.
i have had no prob with sd2 so far using clone and correct me if im wrong but isnt gta3 sd2 latest version?
now this one will work perfectly without hide media in my burner ( its all in wot you set the profile to do)
switch on subs when reading the image as well as fast error skip.
the burner i use is a liteon 24102b to read and write the image so as before having right hardware is fairly important .
i cant sort securerom new with clone YET but will no doubt be some development by olli in some form to sort this in the future im sure, as veterans from the old clone forum will tell yer the updates are worth waiting for ,
actually think this might be one of me first posts here but honestly might be newbie here but have loitered plenty lol