TDK Blu-Ray 25GB 2x Re-writeable BD-RE at supermediastore.
$24.99.

I wanna see scans before I buy any.

I wanna see a 10,000 percent price drop before I buy any!!!! In all honesty, I might consider it once prices drop some, but with all the copy protection crap and the fact that it is imbeded enough to delay release of products, I think I will hold off not only till others have tested to see how well they work, but also till prices drop quite a bit.
Off topic of the copy protection, I have to wonder how well a disk can be read that doesn't have a protective cartrige, with such high data density, and the same polycarbonite disk material. I'm defanatlly going to be sitting back not buying this for a while (fine so I couldn't aford it anyway, but I would still sit back and wait even if I could afford it).

So instead of paying X amount of money to get a Blu-ray disc, you want to get paid 99 times X amount of money and have the Blu-ray disc for free?

Good luck with that!

lol Me too. I learned my lesson with dvdr and wait and watch and wait and watch

looks quite cheap in states, i expect price a little more higher here, my guess is about 35$. is there any BR drive avaible on the US market?

I personally don't think it's that expensive for a RW disc of 25GB, considering it's a new thechnology!
I'm also surprised that the first BD disc I see is an RW model...

So lower price could be expected for write-once media?

Also one of the first bluray drives is soon available in europe/germany
Here

Well YSS is going to buy a Bluray drive for shure...
He started buying Bluray discs without even having a drive yet...
Here is the link to the Discs he got.
http://homepage2.nifty.com/yss/bluray/bluray01.htm

hmm burning 25 gb at 2x?

Reference transfer rate (1X) for DVDR = 11.08 Mbits/s
Reference transfer rate (1X) for Blue-Ray = 54 Mbits/s

So 2X for Blue-Ray is (very) approximatively the same as 10X for DVDR. This is higly approximative as I have no clue, as yet, about the writing strategies.
If by chance 2X Blue-ray is CLV, then it's actually much faster than 10X for DVDR.
Too lazy to perform more calculations

Too much protections for my taste

Right?

From what i've seen, no doubt.

1x BD is 36 Mbps. 54 Mbps (required for BD-video playback) is 1.5x. Burning a full SL BD-R/RE at 2x (72 Mbps) takes about 45 minutes.

For Europeans technikdirekt.de has Panasonic, Sony and TDK media listed although only Sony BD-RE seems to be available now: http://www.technikdirekt.de/main/en/...eray/page.html

You have no choice - I have heard from someone that all blank DVD media will be phased out in 1-2 years, so you will once again be FORCED to buy a new burner, new media - Luckily the next generation dvd players will still read your old DVDs, but eventually they will phase that out too so you are screwed either way

What about the holographic drives?

Sure, we will only have CD-R and BD-RE left.

Greg even without their assumed 75% reject rate of new formats, DVD's are not going anywhere for a long time. Even switching over in 2 years the companies would have to be switching production equipment starting now to be ready. The world will be darn luckey or unluckey (depending on how you look at it) if the new formats even get off the ground by then if ever. The years of testing posted here continue to this day. 10's of thousands of scans and comments means DVD itself is still not 100% yet. This whole process will have to start all over again but at $25 a pop not many people are going to be generating test discs with cd-speed and not many will be jumping in without that new scan data.

Protections yes but ill assume for personal data storage it won't matter. It's the lack of ability to make the discs and mostly the price that will likley kill it or at least put if off for 5 more years for main stream and no doubt the continuing disagreements over protections are putting a big dent in equipment production companies, many of which I think would just like to drop the whole idea compleatly because the markets are so uncertain. Blame Hollywood

Someone corect me if I am wrong, but wasn't it set into law that analog brodcast tv would be done away with by now and all tv signals would be digital? Didn't they change the deadlines etc, because you cannot really force the public to adopt a new standard? Analog still seems to be going alive and strong, and I havent seen any of those free digital to analog converters that they promised they would provide to millions of people that had not changed over yet..... Given substantially more time, not even at of law could phase out a standard, if the public doesn't go along with it. I would like to see them even try to phase out dvd in 2 years. IT will never happen, not in 2 years, and probably not in 5 year.....

It's always possible to make a point without resorting to provocative, unconstructive posting.
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@jsl: thanks for the info about the writing speeds ... I didn't find enough sources, would you happen to have links to BDR strategies explained?

Be forced once again?... When were we forced to buy new generation burners? CDR discs and CDR burners are still around, and it's still up to each one to jump in the DVDR bandwagon or not.

Besides, each time a new technology is popping up, we hear people claiming that the old one will disappear in a short time, which has never happened in actuality, correct me if I'm wrong.

http://www.dvdhs.com and http://www.dvdrwservices.com the two famous URLs on media packaging tell you a funny story about early DVD burners.

Frank with one exception. 8 track

Have you checked the white papers at blu-raydisc.com?